Is there any logical reason to deny customers access to an Economy 7 Meter?

View Tag Cloud
  • meldrewreborn's Avatar
    Level 90
    @JoeSoap

    i doubt that there are rules about charging batteries from grid electricity - the issue is what you do with that stored energy. Consuming it in the residential environment is completely OK. But selling it back into the grid, at least via the SEG, apparently isn’t.
    Current Eon Next and EDF customer, ex Zog and Symbio. Don't think dual fuel saves money and don't like smart meters. Chronologically Gifted. If I offend let me know by private message, but I’ll continue to express my opinions nonetheless.
  • JoeSoap's Avatar
    Level 91
    @JoeSoap

    i doubt that there are rules about charging batteries from grid electricity - the issue is what you do with that stored energy. Consuming it in the residential environment is completely OK. But selling it back into the grid, at least via the SEG, apparently isn’t.

    It's probably all to do with import v export rates and not allowing profits to be made by consumers. That's that all cleared up then 🤔
    I'm an Eon Next dual fuel customer with no particular expertise but have some time on my hands that I am using to try and help out a bit.
  • retrotecchie's Avatar
    Level 91
    @JoeSoap

    Back in the day (30 years ago) I had a place that was all-electric and had Economy 7 and 'Flexiheat'. Four different rates on the tariff (peak and off peak electricity, and off peak heating/hot water and a daytime 'boost' tariff. I used to charge batteries on off-peak rate and run what I could from batteries on-peak.

    It didn't take too much effort and saved a few quid a quarter. Back then, the differential between peak and off peak rates was a matter of pennies. Now the differential is a factor of four or more, much more worth doing. It also helps that modern battery technology has a RTE of better than 90%. Lead acid manages about 80% and NiFe isn't much better than 60%, but that's what we had back then.

    But you cannot use stored battery power to export to the grid for payment.
    Don't shoot me, I'm only the piano player. I DON'T work for or on behalf of EON.Next, but am willing to try and help if I can. Not on mains gas, mobile network or mains drainage. House heated almost entirely by baby dragons.
  • JoeSoap's Avatar
    Level 91
    @JoeSoap

    Back in the day (30 years ago) I had a place that was all-electric and had Economy 7 and 'Flexiheat'. Four different rates on the tariff (peak and off peak electricity, and off peak heating/hot water and a daytime 'boost' tariff. I used to charge batteries on off-peak rate and run what I could from batteries on-peak.

    It didn't take too much effort and saved a few quid a quarter. Back then, the differential between peak and off peak rates was a matter of pennies. Now the differential is a factor of four or more, much more worth doing. It also helps that modern battery technology has a RTE of better than 90%. Lead acid manages about 80% and NiFe isn't much better than 60%, but that's what we had back then.

    But you cannot use stored battery power to export to the grid for payment.

    I'm still unsure about that last sentence but I'll take your word for it as you know more than me about it. It seems from the posts I linked-to that batteries can be connected to the grid but may be excluded from the tariffs that give export rates better than the cheapest import rates.

    Might that mean that it is possible to export to the grid from a battery but only on tariffs that pay an export rate of say 3p/kWh? Therefore, if one chose to do so it would be at a loss against anything imported from the grid to the battery and so not a very sensible move.

    I'm always happy to learn... as long as it isn't calculus 😂
  • retrotecchie's Avatar
    Level 91
    @JoeSoap

    It's technically (and easily) possible, but the SEG rules are designed so that the system can't be gamed for financial advantage.

    The preferential rate for exported units if you have a system installed by your supplier just reflects how overpriced their systems are to start with. Unfortunately, standard SEG rates do not come anywhere near to what they ought to be. The cheapest form of generation is wind and solar, but commercial operators are paid the same price per kWh as oil and gas generators under 'Contract for Difference'.

    So if a commercial solar farm gets paid the same price for a kWh as a gas fired generator, why doesn't SEG fairly reflect that for domestic renewables? A kilowatt-hour is a kilowatt-hour, no matter where it comes from.
  • Lee_EONNext's Avatar
    Community Team
    @JoeSoap @digger

    Let me know if this thread helps - https://community.eonnext.com/thread...2752#post42752
    @digger Has someone at Eon advised you that you can't do this? I was advised a few weeks ago regulations have changed around this.
    Did you know that we're open 24/7 across our Social Media Channels? There are lots of ways to contact us over
    here!
    📣
  • JoeSoap's Avatar
    Level 91

    Still all as clear as mud to me. Seems one has to submit all relevant info and diagrams and let Eon Next decide what you can or cannot have.
  • Lee_EONNext's Avatar
    Community Team
    @JoeSoap People do indeed need to submit alot of paperwork/diagrams etc, it's not Eon Next who decide what you can and cannot have etc, the only thing Eon Next decide is the rate. Everything else is alongside the guidance, which can be found here - https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publication...-seg-licensees

    With regards to charging the battery from the grid and selling this back, this being known as 'brown energy' the regulations on this have changed and i'm told this is allowed.

    However I would always check with service teams of whoever the SEG contract is with, before making any changes or having this installed. This is because the rules and regulations change.

    @digger - Can I just ask for some clarification on your question? Are you looking to charge the battery at night and then sell that back to the grid?
    Last edited by Lee_EONNext; 10-12-23 at 15:03.
  • digger's Avatar
    Level 6
    @JoeSoap @digger

    Let me know if this thread helps - https://community.eonnext.com/thread...2752#post42752
    @digger Has someone at Eon advised you that you can't do this? I was advised a few weeks ago regulations have changed around this.

    No, the only contact I have had with Eon has been regarding having Economy 7. The issue of using my battery to feed back to the grid was raised by another poster. I am sure that my system will not let be back feed to the grid from the battery only from the solar once the battery is full. My problem is the inability of Eon to update my meter from single tariff to duel, though Octopus are able to do it without any problem for my brother-in -law and he has the same meter as me. It seems to me that were there's a will there's a way. I will contact Eon again in the new year when hopefully they have sorted out being able automatically read my export as at the moment I have to send a photo every 3 months.
  • JoeSoap's Avatar
    Level 91
    ... The issue of using my battery to feed back to the grid was raised by another poster...

    That would be me. Sorry if I muddied the water but it still doesn't seem cut and dry to me, although it appears that the rules have recently changed. I alluded to what your intentions were but I should have alluded to how your system was configured with regards to it having the ability to charge a battery from the grid and export back again from the battery. Seems like a mine field to me.