[Tracy]

@JoeSoap I'd also like to say good on you for trying to lower ur usages and make changes so you can still have the small luxurys but in a better way maybe we all need to do this I'm sure there are far worse people out there doing lots that they shouldn't I don't have all the answers I wish we all could live the same and all have good life's but that's a dream for a better life for all that all I can do is hope , Nikola Tesla's tryed to give us all free energy a long time ago he once said if hate could be used for electricity we would light up the whole world they stole his inventions for profit but it makes you wonder why all this hate is really going on 🤔

[JoeSoap]

I would just like to report that as a result of making some changes to the way we consume energy in our house since the beginning of August I can now see some results.

I have used information from The Bright App and cross-checked against my energy statements to make sure I'm in the ball park ok.

August usage is 81% for Elect compared to last year and 73% for Gas.

September is around 72% compared to last year for Gas and Elect.

I'll gather another month's data and then reappraise my monthly DD payments. We are still considerable energy users but so far I estimate we could save about £100 per month just as a result of our economising.

Lots of quite small changes and some not so small have made a real difference and it's good to see them reflected in the figures.

When I signed up to v17 my DD went from £202 to £535 a month so very scary. With the EPSS, EPG, a decent energy account credit balance and the economising, I am now in a far better place.

[JoeSoap]

The money saving continues…

For my sins I’m the food shopper in our house and consider myself quite savvy, but…

I like to buy milk in two-pint containers as they are a handy size and cheaper than buying one-pint sizes. I get miffed when they have run out at the shop and I have to get the four-pint ones which are cumbersome.

I knew the big ones would be cheaper again but was staggered to see by how much. Two pint containers are £1.25 and the four pint ones are only £1.55.

I now buy the four pint ones and split them into two two-pint containers. At 8-10 pints a week it amounts to another £10 a month saving💰💰💰

Happy days 😁

[retrotecchie]

Every penny saved is another penny earned.

Try this for size...the way you cook a meal can make all the difference too. I know this because I'm medieval about my meter readings and owning an electric cooker and hob, and as part of my energy monitoring routine (manual meter readings and an Excel spreadsheet) I often take a meter reading before and after cooking a dinner.

Especially if my missus is cooking, as she's not as unit conscious as I am. Well, she would be if the 'leccy bills came out of her pocket!

Take two identical meals, one cooked by herself a few weeks ago and one cooked by me on Sunday just gone. Times being hard, we usually just graze on stale bread, dry cornflakes or the smell of an oily rag most days, but once or twice a month, we decide we'll spoil ourselves and cook a dinner of sorts.

Peas and carrots all from the freezer, but originally from our garden, so that's the veg. A small/med Morrisons chicken,£3-£4 or so. A slack handful of spuds. Gravy granules because it's quick and they're already in the pantry.

Assume same size portions, same size chicken, give or take, and same cooking time. We're going for roast chicken, roast taters, boiled peas and carrots and a splash of gravy, right? Nothing too outrageous or fancy, just plain old fashioned grub. And yet for us, in these tough times, a veritable banquet.

Assume same rules apply for cooking time for the bird, parboiling time for the potatoes and that preparation is irrelevant. We're just focussing on energy.

Ladies and gentlemen (or rather, the wife and I), start your engines and get those dinners cooked!

Herself scored almost exactly 11 kWh or about £3.85. Me? I'll tell you in a sec, but here's how we cook dinner.

Her: Put oven on to preheat to 200°C.
Me: You don't need to preheat. It's a fan oven!

Her: Fill big saucepan from tap, add potatoes and a pinch of salt. Put on large ring and turn to 6
Me: Boil just enough water in the kettle to cover the potatos in a medium pan. No salt. Cover with lid and put on small ring. Turn to 2

Her: Lightly grease roasting tin, whop in the bird and sling in the preheated oven.
Me: As above, only turning fan oven on as I put the bird in. At same time, put a little oil in a small roasting tin and put that in the oven.

Her: Spuds are just starting to come to the boil, so turn down to 3. Wait 20 minutes.
Me: Spuds are not far off ready and can be turned down to 1 to just keep hot.

Her: Fill medium saucepan with water from the cold tap, add peas and carrots, pinch of salt. On small ring, set to 6.
Me: Pop out into the garden for a quick puff on my pipe, let the dogs out for a wee, then come back in and wash my hands.

Her: Taters are ready so drain them into sink then throw them in a small roasting dish with some oil and put 'em in the oven with the bird.
Me: Grab colander and drain spuds, but draining the water into a smaller pan and putting that back on the hob ring, still set to 1. Add drained spuds to pan of hot oil that's already up to temp in the oven.

Her: Fill kettle and set to boil. Put gravy granules in small pan. When boiled, add water to pan, stir until right, then put on hob. Simmer on 2.
Me: Add peas and carrots to small pan with the still hot potato water, cover with lid. Leave on 1.

Her: Check bird and spuds. Another 5 minutes.
Me: Yep, another five minutes, perhaps. I don't need to open the oven to check. Turn oven off.

Her: Chicken and taters done. Turn oven off. Leave bird on side to rest. Drain veg into sink. Hobs off. Job done.
Me: Yep, all good. Drain veg water into a small pan. Put back on the still hot hob that the veg were on. Add gravy granules, stir for a bit. Everything off.

Dinner is served folks. I'd love to offer you a small glass of wine to go with it, but you know how it is at the moment...times hard, and all that?

Oh, hang on a minute. I'd better just read the meter....

A nadger's under 7kWh.

Or about £2.45 in energy. Saving.... £1.40 or so. For exactly the same meal cooked on exactly the same oven.

Tell you what, good people. I'll cook the next couple of meals as well and maybe I can save up for a cheeky glass of Lidl's finest budget white after all. Cheers!


But, speaking seriously.

1. Boiling water in the kettle is about three times as economical, or a third of the energy, as heating up cold water in a pan on the hob. And you only need to boil it once.

2. If you have a modern electric fan oven it DOES NOT need preheating. Honest guv, it doesn't. No matter what Nigella Lawson says.

3. Likewise a modern oven can be turned off a few mins before the end of cooking. They're insulated. Unless you open the door, it won't cool very much.

4. Retain all the valuable heat you have used in your cooking water, rather than heating another cold pan up. Use a lid!

5. Not only will your dinner be cheaper to cook, it probably tastes better too and will be better for you.

Why? Because the potato water you have retained will have a little starch in it. It won't affect your veg, but when it ends up in the gravy....mmm.

Not only that, when you cook your veg, some of the vitamins and nutrients (and a bit of flavour) leach out into the water. Make your gravy with the same water...everything ends up in the gravy. You're not making your gravy with plain old water, but in essence you are making it with a veg boullion.

And no wasted heat poured down the sink at any point, or bringing any water up to the boil from cold, except the once in the kettle.

I'm probably teaching Granny to suck eggs here with many of you, and I apologise for the long winded post, but if there are a few of you who can pick up one or two energy saving cooking tips...and a few people can save a few pence here and there....

Over time, it all adds up. Cheers 🥂

[Andy65]

Get a steamer (you'll have to splash out a bit) @retrotecchie, spuds in the bottom and veg on top. The veg retain more taste in my opinion and cook quicker.

[JoeSoap]

@retrotecchie

I’m with you on pre-boiling in the kettle and then pouring into the pan, but we have a gas hob so don’t know if I’m saving or not. It just seems quicker.

I always use veggie water for gravy too… much tastier.

[meldrewreborn]

@retrotecchie @JoeSoap @Andy65

My life would be cut short if I attempted anything like this, but we’ve always been on gas for hob and oven so we might use much the same in energy terms but pay only 30% as much as an electric user.
the reason is partly historical but partly practical. Gas is a more flexible fuel, and when power cuts were frequent the wish to have alternative energy supply was a consideration, price has been a factor for many years but I don’t recall doing the sums back then.
Plus gas appliances rarely need parts!
The range of appliances is narrower than it used to be and more expensive initially, but I’d go gas again.

[JoeSoap]

@meldrewreborn

We have gas hob, boiler and fire in the lounge. Electric oven, immersion heater, microwave and some convector heaters in a cupboard.

Any loss of gas and we’re ok for heat, hot water and cooking. Loss of electric and we can cook and heat water on the hob and huddle round the gas fire. Loss of both together and it’s cold beans, cold water and cold house.

That reminds me… I must get some more candles… just in case 😁

[Andy65]

I prefer gas for the hob and electric for the oven.

Thinking back to my Physics lessons at school it was straight forward to calculate the energy required to raise 1 litre of water from x deg C to y deg C. So although boiling a kettle for the pan is quicker, my logic is it's more expensive as the price per kWh is 3 times that of gas. However, that's without taking account of the thermal properties of what kettles and pans are used, losses etc.

I could do an experiment and boil a litre in each and from my smart meters I'd know for certain which is cheaper (although as I've E7 it would be a 3 way competition), but I'm not sure if I'd be able to sleep at night if I recklessly used all of that energy.

[retrotecchie]

There is a video on YouTube on a channel called Technology Connections which is really about why Americans rarely use electric kettles. It actually goes a long way to explaining just why using an electric kettle, even a maximum 1500W 120v one is faster and more effective than heating water on a gas hob.

Bottom line is because the element is directly in contact with the water so the energy transfer is far more efficient. Sure, my post was aimed more at your all-electric folks like me. Of course, the 'leccy is 3 and a bit times more expensive per kWh than gas, which is why saving all you can is helpful.

Two houses ago, we had a double width dual fuel range. Electric oven and bottled gas hob. We made a 47kg propane bottle last about 14 months, which worked out at about £50 a year. I kind of miss it, but we also had oil fired heating. The logistics of living off the gas grid are far more complicated - the ten mile round trip to the garage to change a (heavy) propane bottle, and the same round trip to the garage to fill a couple of 25 litre drums of kerosene when you ran out of oil and your tanker delivery isn't due for a week.

The new place is a former pub. Originally a single storey two room building, it had a small lean-to kitchen tacked on the back at the turn of last century (1902) and an upstairs added in the 1950s. Completely refurbished in 2021 as we were moving in, and the coke burner with back boiler and a gravity fed water tank was replaced with a modern oil-fired combi and modern radiators throughout. Unfortunately, because of the size of the kitchen, the boiler located in the garden and the issues of two-foot thick solid stone walls downstairs, bottled gas for cooking was ruled out due to complexity and timescale.

Pence per kWh, it's the leccy that really makes the eyes water.

Yes, it's a different way of life off the gas grid (and sewage and mobile phone networks), but the views make up for the inconveniences.

I've just ordered 500 litres of heating oil. 84p a litre. At about 10.4kWh per litre, a unit of heat works out at 8.07p per kWh, so a bit cheaper than gas right now. Sure, payment up front for a delivery is a shocker, but that 500 litres lasts 8 months between Feb and Sept, and four months in winter.

Where oil really blows gas out of the water...no daily standing charges. They are the killer. No amount of energy saving frugality can cut down on that cost.