[meldrewreborn]

Originally Posted by rwh202

Even if few people choose to take advantage of the features that smart meters offer, what are the disadvantages?

Well everybody pays for them through their bill and comparatively few will ever save money from them as a result. Thats a real issue to me.

those who have simple unsophisticated systems are paying to subsidise the better off tech savvy. Perhaps it’s the same as subsidies given early on to those installing solar panels, and getting huge prices for the power exported. It was the poor subsidising the rich.

I don’t criticise those who take advantage though - it’s everyone for themselves - and if they then choose to help others in other ways that’s OK by me too.

[meldrewreborn]

@geoffers

for me just because it’s possible to do something that doesn’t mean it actually provides a real benefit in terms of lifestyle or financially. Those who invest early in consumer tech often lose out. Even investing in tech companies carries enormous risk. For every success like apple microsoft amazon and tesla there are thousands of failures.

[rwh202]

@meldrewreborn
The cost is a bit separate - that's just usual Government incompetence and mismanagement.
Smart meters themselves aren't expensive and every meter installed over the past 15 years of dragged out rollout should have been one. Plus 50% of all previously installed meters should have been replaced over that period anyway due to certification expiring.
The extra burden and cost of replacing the others is not huge and should have been pennies on a bill.
Looked at the other way, if we'd all got fully working smart meters, no one would be proposing a rollout of dumb meters to replace them all...

[meldrewreborn]

Originally Posted by Indyk_EONNext

Honestly @geoffers it was something I have been putting off for a number of reasons, but now I feel I really need one as I can't keep up to date with adding manual readings. Whether they do actually help me manage my usage, that's another thing but I guess everyone has different views on them. 😊

I put off getting them because I consider the whole scheme a colossal waste of our money. But eventually my meters were well passed their certified lives and so I bowed to the inevitable.

Smart metering does have some advantages I readily concede. But will they save me money -No. Are they worth it to us as a nation - No.
Mine are fully functional as designed, some are not so lucky.

[geoffers]

Originally Posted by meldrewreborn

Well everybody pays for them through their bill and comparatively few will ever save money from them as a result. Thats a real issue to me.

Unfortunately you're only viewing it based from the viewpoint of an individual's (ie you) minimal cost savings.

It's an (unfortunate, maybe) fact of life that we're being driven by the "powers that be" down the route to electrification using green energy, so "smart" monitoring and balancing of energy consumption seems to be the ultimate and sensible goal.

I guess everything is still pretty much in it's infancy, but if you look around you may have noticed the number of people who have already bought PV systems and are investing in battery storage etc, which although costly to install hopefully pays back the investment with cost savings over a number of years.

I can only assume that the reason people are using "smart" systems to monitor their usage will be to consume their own generated/stored electricity, plus export excess to the grid when the grid energy cost is high.

Then to use the grid for their consumption/storage when the grid energy cost is low.

Hopefully as technology develops these solutions will become mainstream, rather than just the growing number of tech-savvy individuals who are setting up their own systems.

So without planning for a future "smart" grid none of this would have been possible. (irrespective of whether it has been correctly rolled out cost/technology wise : it's now a fact of life)

[WizzyWigg]

Morning @geoffers put me on the viewing list. I have to agree with @meldrewreborn. In my humble opinion the way things are I'll be surprised if the grid will survive the demands of the future, let alone a "smart" one unless investments are directed to the more important projects. I don't mean solar, wind etc. Infrastructure infrastructure infrastructure. Just take a look at what happened yesterday 😉.

[meldrewreborn]

@geoffers

those with solar PV and or EVs are very much the minority. Eventually the cost of those products may reduce to the point where their adoption becomes a slam dunk, but we’re not there yet.

what does seem clear is that the cost of delivering a decarbonised energy system will initially substantially increase costs in the short term and then might reduce costs in the medium to long term. While this will be marginally good for the entire world, we may be wasting our time unless others do likewise, and severely worsening our economic wellbeing in the process. Miliband is the most highly rated Labour minister amongst Labour Party members, while probably being the most disliked by voters generally. There’s a good reason for the latter. Not that I’m saying voters get it right all the time.

[geoffers]

Originally Posted by WizzyWigg

Morning @geoffers put me on the viewing list. I have to agree with @meldrewreborn. In my humble opinion the way things are I'll be surprised if the grid will survive the demands of the future, let alone a "smart" one unless investments are directed to the more important projects. I don't mean solar, wind etc. Infrastructure infrastructure infrastructure. Just take a look at what happened yesterday 😉.

Yep I agree totally, which is why I qualified my second sentence 😁

I still think we should still be developing available N.Sea gas fields for energy independence in conjunction with the (admirable) push towards renewables, since relying on 3rd countries (55% Norway; 30%+ North America; 5% Quatar etc) doesn't strike me as secure or a particularly green way of procuring our energy

However, we have to live with what we've got (rather than continually moaning about it 😂) and personally I'm thinking of installing my own solar to give a degree of independence from situations like the Spain/Portugal blackout.

Doubt if I'll live long enough to see the return on my investment, but feel it's better to put the money somewhere useful rather than the taxman getting his grubby hands on it via IHT 😏

[WizzyWigg]

Originally Posted by geoffers

I'm thinking of installing my own solar to give a degree of independence from situations like the Spain/Portugal blackout.

That's good👍. Some can, lots can't or won't 😉.

[meldrewreborn]

@geoffers

most people don’t use their smart meters for any other purpose than they did with dumb meters - they measure consumption. Many household have never switched tariffs or suppliers. Comparatively few have taken advantage of fixed price tariffs to avoid price cap rises. Many still pay for the consumption by paying after the event (not by direct debit) although it’s the most expensive option. I’ve tried in the past to convince people I know to switch and they take no action.

If people can’t take simple and easy actions to cut their energy cost now, what hope is there of them going for investment in solar, EV, or battery storage in the near future?

Personally, I’ve looked at Solar PV (My roofs face east west so far from ideal), electric cars and battery storage for my situation. None of them currently come close to stacking up financially, nor does replacing my near 37 year old boiler. I suspect my analysis is shared with others who approach these matters using their head rather than their heart, if they bother at all, which the vast majority don’t. It’s easier to complain about things than actually doing something to fix them.