[KeithWilliamson]

I want to be able to read current and voltage, not just kW, using the L+G SMETS1 smart meter. Model E470.

This meter has a black surround to the display, the A button to the R of the display and the small round B button below the display. Despite the fact that this model is obsolete, there is a picture of it at https://www.landisgyr.eu/product/landisgyr-e470/.

This meter was originally installed by NPower in 2017, but eONNext have been successfully reading it as a smart meter since they took over the NPower business in about 2019 and my account by default.

Apart from the fact that, for some crazy reason, Landis+Gyr use the same model number E470, for several completely different smart meters, they seem to be a distinctly unhelpful organisation. Their website specifically says they will not help domestic customers, but suggest seeking help from your energy supplier.

There is a lot of information on the web about how to read the kWh imported through the meter, which is quite straightforward. there are also pictures of this meter displaying voltage, as well as KW, and kWh imported and exported. Other L+G smart meters display Amps and Volts, so I assume this one can too.

I've hunted the web to find a user manual for this model of meter, without any success.

I already know that a long press on A, followed by multiple presses on A will get me to see kWh Imported and Exported, and instantaneous kW.

Does anyone out there know the sequence of button presses to get to the volts and amps display?

[retrotecchie]

@KeithWilliamson

E470 is only a part of the actual model number. There is usually another four digits that drill down to the actual model, software revision and capabilities.

I've never seen any L&G meter having V and I displays accessible to the end user, but some hidden displays can be accessed by engineers using the optical modem and suitable software.

Volts is not a problem, and neither is current. If you need both of those values, there are non invasive ways of getting that information without having to worry about the meter.

[KeithWilliamson]

Thanks, my neighbour has a SMETS2 L+G meter, which does show V and A.

I am an electrical engineer, and have Fluke clamp-on ammeters and calibrated true RMS voltmeters. So I think I know how to do it non-invasively.

The background is that I have recently had solar panels installed and all the instrumentation disagrees with the smart meter for instantaneous kW.

I find it very difficult to believe the smart meter is reading 33% high all the time, when compared with 4 other meters. I believe that type of fault in a smart meter is very rare. But I wanted to double check it before I ask EON for an independent meter check.

[retrotecchie]

@KeithWilliamson

There is a discrepancy between kWh and KVAh. But you'll know all about phase relationships between RMS current and voltage and how energy meters use four quadrant multiplication to calculate both real and apparent power and figure out which way it is flowing. Just measuring I and V won't often give you the right answer with out knowing if the current is leading or lagging the voltage and by how much.

I'm afraid my recollection of phase angles and all the time domain ω and cos(Φ) malarley is a fading memory now, but I suspect the discrepancy you are seeing is something to do with the difference between real and apparent power.

I know on my inverter, Watts and VA are about a factor of 1.3 different.

[JoeSoap]

Originally Posted by retrotecchie

... I know on my inverter, Watts and VA are about a factor of 1.3 different.

That sits nicely with a 33% discrepancy but I daren't comment on this as phase angles malarkey is above what used to be my pay grade as a mere technician.

[retrotecchie]

@JoeSoap

I try and stick to DC....the maths is simpler!

[retrotecchie]

@KeithWilliamson

What you can try, if your meter firmware supports it, is press and hold the A button for >2 seconds. This should take you to the rolling display list. A quick press on the A button from here will cycle you through the following displays:

Total Active Import, Voltage and Current. These are only accessible if the meter has not been PIN protected.

To leave the rolling display list, simply leave the meter for 30 seconds without pressing any buttons.

[geoffers]

Originally Posted by retrotecchie

@KeithWilliamson

What you can try, if your meter firmware supports it, is press and hold the A button for >2 seconds. This should take you to the rolling display list. A quick press on the A button from here will cycle you through the following displays:

Total Active Import, Voltage and Current. These are only accessible if the meter has not been PIN protected.

To leave the rolling display list, simply leave the meter for 30 seconds without pressing any buttons.

If it's any help, I posted a while back with the menu presses for the L+G meter here
https://community.eonnext.com/thread...SMETS2?p=37316

[KeithWilliamson]

Thanks Retrotecchie.

Yes I understand about power factor - I was in the gen set industry for 40 years. I realise, if I measure current and volts with separate meters, I am getting kVA when I multiply the two rms values together. However, even with non-unity power factor load leading or lagging, kVA is always going to be a bigger number than kW. I am getting a kVA number that is 25% less than the kW number the smart meter is giving. In other words the smart meter is reading 33% more than my separate meters.

In fact I am testing by running a couple of 3kW fan heaters which are virtually exactly unity power factor in any case, so I'm pretty convinced that power factor is not the issue here.

As you suggest, I press the A button for a few seconds until time shows, then multiple presses take me through time, date, credit mode, meter balance, standing charge (p/day), ?, active power (kW), total active import kWh, Rate 1 of active import (p/kWh), total active export (kWh), MID Cal (?), CALC - then back to time. No sign of amps or volts. I think some of those parameters relate if the meter was set up as a prepayment meter.

This is set up as a credit meter, by the way, EOn take a DD off me every month!

[KeithWilliamson]

I too found the manual for the SMETS2 and 3 versions of the E470 but the menu structures are obviously not the same as this SMETS1 (2017) L&G E470 meter.

Thanks everyone for your input!