£500 bill for an empty property

  • meldrewreborn's Avatar
    Level 91
    @retrotecchie

    i suspect that the tariff data will be corrected eventually. The EPG operates from Oct and while there were many issues at the beginning I don’t recall tariff prices causing these issue then.
    Current Eon Next and EDF customer, ex Zog and Symbio. Don't think dual fuel saves money and don't like smart meters. Chronologically Gifted. If I offend let me know by private message, but I’ll continue to express my opinions nonetheless.
  • meldrewreborn's Avatar
    Level 91
    @RichHaynes

    what prices were being shown previously? The net of EPG prices or the gross supplier price. I suspect it was the former and so this is an update issue.
  • retrotecchie's Avatar
    Level 92
    @meldrewreborn

    As the regional pricing is down to the OFGEM rates for a region rather than being supplier specific, I'd be willing to take a punt that prices are rolled out across the networks on a regional basis by DCC/OFGEM and then any further tweaking or adjustment is then carried out on a per supplier/per customer basis. I'm suspecting that what is happening is that the regional rates were sent out by OFGEM on 01 January as a bulk message, and the suppliers are lagging a bit behind applying corrected or post EPG rates. Just a guess...
    Don't shoot me, I'm only the piano player. I DON'T work for or on behalf of EON.Next, but am willing to try and help if I can. Not on mains gas, mobile network or mains drainage. House heated almost entirely by baby dragons.
  • meldrewreborn's Avatar
    Level 91
    @retrotecchie

    I disagree. Suppliers can charge less than the OFGEM rates and indeed this time I think OVO has said it will lower prices in line with OFGEM amended by EPG but not increase the others, and E.On Next said it would not increase prices for prepayment customers. We've also seen than economy 7 rates vary from one supplier to another. So there is no possibility of the tariff rates being issued by any other party than the customers own supplier.

    DCC do not originate any data, nor are they able to look at it as it passes through. They are just the conduit for data between the supplier and the meter(s). The data is encrypted and supposedly not interceptable by any other party.

    While there are a lot of meters to update, I would imagine its a fairly easy task for a competent company to prepare the data files and submit them to DCC for implementation in a short timescale. The system is intended to be able to cope with truly massive volumes (think half hourly readings) and rates have changed every 6 months (now 3 months) in the past, and these issues have not arisen (as far as I can remember and as you know I'm chronologically gifted!) This isn't new but it does need organisation. Since the meters are not billing devices, there is no need for them to hold suppliers tariff prices first and then be changed down to EPG levels, other than if the method of updating adopted by the supplier does the update to customers accounts simultaneously with the smart meters . But even then the EPG discount would not go to the meters, and for the meters rates are VAT inclusive.

    A thought occurred to me earlier as a result of a discussion with @Mailman on provisional billing for gas and the need for an accurate Calorific Value for the conversion from volume to kWh. For the in house display to function there must be an approximate factor to convert the volume consumed to kWh, as the accurate figure will not be available. So Gas cost displays are more approximated, while electricity is virtually exact.
  • retrotecchie's Avatar
    Level 92
    @meldrewreborn

    Yes a kilowatt is a kilowatt of electricity, no matter watt! Gas quality is a continuously variable, er, variable. Back in the day, I remember being billed for gas in cubic feet. There probably were conversion factors involved but I was only ever billed by volume and never in kWh, IIRC.

    If the rates are completely screwed and erroneous, then it's E.On Next who are entirely responsible for dropping a bill-hook and confusing/scaring the punters then? About right...



    Last edited by retrotecchie; 07-01-23 at 16:57.
  • meldrewreborn's Avatar
    Level 91
    @retrotecchie

    I still am billed in '000 cu ft! I did say " I would imagine its a fairly easy task for a competent company to prepare the data files" but the caveat was deliberately there for a reason!
  • retrotecchie's Avatar
    Level 92
    @meldrewreborn

    Do you still have one of the old grey 'sit up and beg' Schlumberger style meters with the old whirly-wheels then? Utterly reliable, no batteries to worry about...proper meter👍
  • Mailman's Avatar
    Level 55
    A thought occurred to me earlier as a result of a discussion with @Mailman on provisional billing for gas and the need for an accurate Calorific Value for the conversion from volume to kWh. For the in house display to function there must be an approximate factor to convert the volume consumed to kWh, as the accurate figure will not be available. So Gas cost displays are more approximated, while electricity is virtually exact.

    I believe they use a value of CV = 40.0 but I've not seen that in stone anywhere but will run some numbers on my kWh gas usage by Sunday. Not a great deal of difference at say using 39.5 but I will come back to you on this 👍
  • meldrewreborn's Avatar
    Level 91
    @Mailman

    i think the cv in the meters is a fixed value, so long as it is close to actual values. I think just one fiigure would be needed incorporating all the factors, because the others apart from the CV are fixed/constant. I suppose it comes down to how close is close
    I read that the IHD shows both volume and kWh so the fixed value might be easy to determine. This from the person who hasn’t got one!
  • meldrewreborn's Avatar
    Level 91
    @meldrewreborn

    Do you still have one of the old grey 'sit up and beg' Schlumberger style meters with the old whirly-wheels then? Utterly reliable, no batteries to worry about...proper meter👍
    Yes an R5 in a delightful shade of khaki.